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RE: DIY sump pump setup?

CryHavoc — Sat, 24 May 2008 20:30:17 GMT

Conner, as far as what you have read regarding the drilling of tempered glass it is a misstatement. The tanks that have holes predrilled are done before the glass is tempered. If you attempt to drill into tempered glass you will shatter it into a million pieces. The tempering process pushes all the stress in the glass to the edges and makes the glass stronger. When drilling it changes the stress pattern in the glass and if there is ANY heat at all during the drilling it begins to form a mini tempering spot that affects the strength and stability of the piece.

The following is from the diamondsure website a maker of speciality drillbits:

Drilling Tempered Glass - Not Recommended

Tempered glass can be drilled, however, breakage may run as high as 80% to 90% depending upon the degree of temper in the glass. We do not recommend trying to drill tempered glass.

The manufacturing process of making tempered glass results in the glass having a large amount of stress between various portions of the glass. The stress points might look much like a piece of wood containing lots of "knots", however, there is no outward appearance to indicate the hidden stress. Highly tempered glass will often crack at the stress points near the hole. Since the amount of hidden stress increases with the degree of temper, the success rate of drilling tempered glass reduces with the increase in glass temper.

There is no way to know the amount of temper in a piece of tempered glass, so there is no way to evaluate the amount of risk involved in trying to drill it. Therefore, we DO NOT RECOMMEND attempting to drill tempered glass.

Hopes this Helps

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 16:03:08 GMT

Thinking more about it, I'll probably next set up an asian fish tank, which the eel would transfer into, and then I could add barbs/loaches/other asian fish to. That would negate the problem with keeping smaller fish in the 125g south american tank.

There's a reallllly nice 72g bowfront at my lfs that would be perfect for it. Or maybe a 90g reef ready.....

HELP! I HAVE MTS!!

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 18:43:24 GMT

I've already got the eel. I will be observing them to make sure they get along, but the eel hasn't really shown any predatory behavior except towards earthworms. If he does try to eat the rams, they can be moved to other tank, or even re-homed if necessary, so that shouldn't be too big of an issue.

Or else the eel will get a new home. I really like the rams

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Mrcracker2u — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 16:06:39 GMT

Watch the eel. They get big and will eat your rams. Look for a type that stays small. Or get a group of bigger loaches.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:21:22 GMT

Well, I'm STILL waiting on the 125g tank that comes with everything (lights, filters, substrate, sump DIY from a HOB I think). The guy I'm getting it from is still waiting to get his new tank delivered from Chicago. If I don't get it this weekend, I'm going out and buying a new one, since I don't have any more time to waste on this guy (it's like 4 weeks late already!).

I would prefer to get this guys tank, because it comes with a live substrate and filters, and wouldn't need to be cycled.

You can be sure once I get it set up, I'll be posting plenty of pictures. I have a couple pieces of really nice driftwood soaking so that they'll be ready to go in, and all my fish are eagerly anticipating the new tank as well.

If I end up having to buy a new system, I'm going to get a 125g tank that's reef-ready from my LFS. I can build a decent stand for like $50, a decent sump for $50-75, and with a lighting system from Home Depot or Lowe's (and the sand substrate), it won't be too damaging to my pocket book.

I also traded in my Glass Cats, Hatchetfish, and Gold Algae Eater for store credit today. So here's what's going in the new tank once I get it:

3 angelfish
1 spotted pictus
1 tire track eel
1 dragon goby
1 banjo catfish
2-6 of the german rams (depending on if any pair up to go in the 20L)

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Mrcracker2u — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 14:15:33 GMT

Since your asking about sumps again I dug this up so you could let us know what you decided on and show us some pics......LOL

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Tue, 12 Feb 2008 12:40:02 GMT

Hey. I didn't get a chance to ask about getting it reef-ready. Checking at one of my other local LFS's, I found a 120 gallon reef ready aquarium that would have cost about $200 more than the quoted price of the other tank, which only included the tank and a light, no cabinet, filters, or anything. Plus, my brother would have been buying the other tank at a 20% discount, so I couldn't have found a comparable price except with a used tank.

I haven't gotten the used tank yet, its current owner is still finding some homes for fish, but I am getting it by the end of the month. Its got 2 HOB's and a canister, so I may not need the sump, depending on how much trouble it is (i don't think its drilled, I think its a HOB DIY version). On the other hand, I'm getting a 29gallon sump tank already set up, so why not?

Also, I have read a couple of articles that say tempered glass CAN be drilled. I've also seen tanks for sale that say they are tempered glass, but have had holes drilled in them to make them reef ready. Is it possible, just much much more difficult to drill tempered glass, or are these just miss-statements?

I will have to check with the guy I'm buying from to see if its tempered, and if he doesn't know, I guess I'll be calling the manufacturer!

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Mrcracker2u — Tue, 12 Feb 2008 08:14:47 GMT

Conner, sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.

Did you ask the store if they sell reef ready or drilled tanks? what was the cost difrence?

Did you get the used tank???

Pics please if you did I would like to see what ya got.

Drilling glass is alot scareir sounding then it acualy is. Keep it lubrcated with water and drill slow and constant. Do not apply presure, let the drill do the work and don't twist or wobble the bit. YOU CAN'T DRILL TEMPERED GLASS but normal glass is just fine, checking with the manufacturer will give you the info on that. Most large tanks use thicker glass and tempering cost more so they tend not to use it. Small tanks on the other hand they use tempered bottoms often as they can use thinner glass and save money as well as reduce the risk of someone getting hurt moving the tanks around. Large tanks don't get moved often so again another cost efective reason not to use tempered glass.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Fri, 08 Feb 2008 18:21:57 GMT

Well its been decided. I found a guy on Craigslist with a 125 gallon for (relatively) cheap. It comes with 2 HOB's, a Rena XP-3, and a DIY sump. I'm checking it out this weekend, and if it looks good I'll be bringing it home at the end of the month!

He said the HOB's were Emperor 350's, so I'm not sure if he meant Penguin 350's or Emperor 400's..... I'll have to find out.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

ILuvMyGoldBarb — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 17:43:48 GMT

As big a fan as I am of the Eheims, I personally am also a fan of having more than one filter on a 6' tank. You just can't get flow to all parts of the tank effectively with just a single filter. That said, I am also a big fan of sumps.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

bto83 — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 15:15:53 GMT

Conner (2/7/2008)

2 Aquaclear 70's - $72 - 200gph filtering capacity

100gph is the "full flow control" setting (fully-restricted flow) for Aquaclear 70's; the maximum setting is 300gph per filter, so two of them would get you 600 gph. That's probably running empty though (no media to slow output).

Gph is only part of the equation, and as you might guess from my 500 gph/125 gallons, not something I worry about too much. I think a pair of Aquaclear 70's would work fine if you increase the amount of bio-media each contains.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:48:56 GMT

There is also a 125 gallon at nearly the same price where I intend to get the 110. The 125 would be a tighter fit where I want it, but it would still fit. I suppose I could go with either one, although I like the look of the taller tank a littler better. It's up at a level where you don't have to crouch to see into the tank, which I like. But I could do either tank.

Also, the dragon goby, pictus, and eel get along fine. Sometimes I'll catch all 3 hiding together under the same rock!

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:38:04 GMT

Here's my filter options:

2 Aquaclear 70's - $72 - 200gph filtering capacity

1 Ehiem 2217 - $149.99 - 264 gph filtering capacity

1 Rena XP3 - $119.99 - claims 350 gph flow rate, not sure filtering capacity

Sump - <$50 supplies, excluding drilling glass. As much filtering as I can fit under tank.

I would love to try the sump, but am hesitant to drill the tank. I could buy 3 Aquaclear 70's for the price of the Ehiem or comparable canister filter.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Lumberjack — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:35:32 GMT

BTW "reef ready" tanks come pre drilled....

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

bto83 — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:30:58 GMT

That's a very tall tank... are you limited to having only a 4 foot long tank by your living space? None of your fish will really make much use of the extra height of the tank over a 75/90g, but they would certainly make use of the extra length of a 6 foot long 100 or 125 gallon tank - especially all the large bottom dwellers - and the cost should be roughly similar.

And for what it's worth, I am currently running a 125g with a single Aquaclear 110 (using a liter of Ehfisubstrat Pro in place of activated carbon), which has 100% of the filtration capability I need. The largest fish I have in there though are a half dozen silver dollars.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Lumberjack — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:00:14 GMT

For that size tank I would suggest a cannister instead of HOB. The HOB filters dont really have nearly as much capacity and for the cost of two or three HOB filters you can pick up a very nice Cannister....

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 13:46:16 GMT

The tank I am researching (and have my heart set on) is a 110 gallon tall. I believe its 48"L x 18"D x 30"H. I will be using a small gravel substrate, supplemented with driftwood and maybe a couple of stacked rocks to create some caves. I want to plant this tank lightly to moderately. Once its set up and cycled, I will be transferring 3 angelfish, 1 spotted pictus, 1 tiretrack eel, and 1 dragon goby (at least until he gets his own brackish tank). I am also looking to possibly add a school of Congo Tetras, or maybe a pair of Leopard Ctenopomas (haven't really decided, and I'm still open to suggestions).

The tank only comes with a basic 48" light with 2-20 watt bulbs, but I will be replacing that with a DIY lighting system that should be able to handle any wattage I want/need (I love home improvement stores ).

I was planning 2 Aquaclear 70 HOB's, because that will easily handle my tank load, and has 600 gph EDIT: FLOW capacity. Only 200 gph filtering capacity. Also, one would continue running while I maintained the other.

I like the idea of a sump, but I don't really want to pay someone else to drill the tank if its more than $50, and I am hesitant to try it myself on a tank this expensive for my first attempt. If you have any suggestions, or any diagrams you could send me/post, that would be awesome. I'm mainly leaning toward the HOB's because I've never done a sump before, even though I have a basic understanding of it.

conner

EDIT: Haha, I love the "Bio-Tower" in the pictures. Very creative.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Mrcracker2u — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 07:25:47 GMT

Conner, Go with the sump you will love it.

Your LFS should be able to get you in touch with someone that can drill it for you. Average cost is $50.00 a hole, or you can buy a cheap bit for under $50.00 and drill it yourself. Just go slow and keep the bit lubricated with clean fresh water. Much scarier sounding then it realy is. Over flow boxes work great but they are more prone to overflows same as over flow pipes I have used both but drilling is the cats meow.

What are your plans for the tank?

Sumps are awsome projects for DIYers. They incorperate all of your skills and realy give you a chance to dream up some wild stuff. 10 gallons is to small for a 110 you want at least 40gln and Rubbermaid bins work just as good as a tank.

Check this post http://board.fishchannel.com/Topic124213-5-1.aspx It has some pic problems but it's alot of good info and the system has run flawlessly to date.

BTW I would be more then happy to help you out with ideas or send you to some sites that have great plans and such.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 19:09:32 GMT

Wow, that is a great article about sumps! Thanks so much. I don't know yet if I'm ready to try a sump or not. The tank I'm planning on getting isn't pre-drilled, and although I think it would be great for my planned setup, I may go with just HOB's to start with for ease of use. But its something I'll definitely have to think about. I am pretty good at plumbing.....

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

RickR — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 16:31:15 GMT

I would definitely go with the sump. It not only gives you a place for your heaters and filters but it also increases your water volume and hence your tanks stability. I would go larger then 10 gal, as big as you have room for, for the maximum benefit.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Lumberjack — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 15:20:42 GMT

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-01/gt/index.php

This is a pretty decent article on sumps and thier setup...

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

math-only aquarium — Tue, 05 Feb 2008 20:18:13 GMT

Ditto, sump filters are great options for large tanks.

RE: DIY sump pump setup?

Lumberjack — Tue, 05 Feb 2008 14:34:38 GMT

Sumps are good filtration if you have a place for it. It allows a lot of stuff to remain hidden and the exact filration can be customised to your exact needs. If you are just getting the tank then now is the time to set it up for a sump as it is very hard to drill the glass after you fill it.....

DIY sump pump setup?

Conner — Tue, 05 Feb 2008 13:31:12 GMT

I am considering getting a 110 gallon aquarium setup, and was trying to decide the best way to filter it. I have several options:

multiple HOB filters
HOB filter + canister filter
canister filter alone
sump pump.

Now, I'm not sure I completely understand the sump pump. Could anyone explain it to me in simple terms? I have a 10 gallon tank just sitting around waiting to be used. Could it be used for a the sump pump portion?

Thanks,
Conner

PS- this will be a lightly-moderately planted tank, containing a spiny eel, 3 angels, and a spotted pictus, for starters.