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RE: damsles?

Nep2Ns PlumR — Sun, 23 Mar 2008 05:48:59 GMT

Once cycled, damselfishes are good fish to learn the basics with. As stated, they are the least expensive of the saltwater fishes and are forgiving of lapses if husbandry.

It may all sound a little daunting, but it's really not that difficult.

But be warned:

AQUARIUM KEEPING IS ADDICTING (especially saltwater for me). ONCE YOU START, THERE'S NO GOING BACK!!!!

I read somewhere that aquarium keeping was the second largest hobby in the world. Second only to photography.

RE: damsles?

deluxerider — Sat, 22 Mar 2008 22:34:31 GMT

I would agree fishless cycling is the way to go. It may take a bit longer but everything acclimates better.

As far as Damsels, I would start w/ Green Chromis they are hardy, very peaceful, create beautiful schools and not aggressive.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Sat, 22 Mar 2008 07:12:48 GMT

It's the same thing you have to do for freshwater tanks...getting the beneficial bacterial colonies started that will consume the ammonia and nitrite and keep the fish safe. You can do it by slowly introducing fish (called "cycling with fish") but that puts them at great risk and causes them pain as they have to suffer through the ammonia and nitrite spikes (and it takes a lot of water changes to keep them from dying, which in saltwater is very expensive). The other alternative is "fishless cycling", which is introducing an ammonia source other than live fish to get the bacteria growing so that when you add fish, there are already enough bacteria to take care of any ammonia or nitrite put out by the fish. Usually in freshwater that ammonia source is pure ammonia, but for some reason that is not used in saltwater tanks (not sure why really). In saltwater you can drop in a medium to large sized cocktail shrimp per ten gallons of water and just let it rot in a tank with no livestock (live rock and/or sand should be in the tank during this though...just nothing else like fish or shrimp).

You want to monitor the ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate periodically throughout the process whether you cycle with fish or not (though with fish it is imperative that it is checked every day and water changes are done if needed, while with fishless cycling once a week is fine, just to know when you're done). It can potentially be much faster to cycle a saltwater tank than a freshwater because of the live sand and/or rock. The bacteria are already present in decent numbers in good live sand and rock, so the tank has a good head start cycling. It may take as little as a day or two after the shrimp disintegrates (you want to wait for it to do that because you want the ammonia source to all be let out into the water column). In freshwater tanks it typically takes a month or more. You'll know when you're done when both the ammonia and nitrite have spiked and fallen to 0ppm and stayed there, and you will likely need to do a very large water change to get the nitrate down to 0ppm before adding livestock.

Does all that make sense? It's kind of hard for me to explain. Here is something for freshwater tanks that will help explain it better (the premise is basically the same for saltwater though there are bacteria in saltwater that help control nitrate too, which you can read about later). http://fish.orbust.net/cycling.html

RE: damsles?

MoorishIdol — Sat, 22 Mar 2008 05:09:19 GMT

one question...

WHAT IS CYCLING?

yeah, as you can see, i dont really know much about saltwater tank keeping. thats why i am on here to ask questions and stuff so i can learn.

so thanks for helping!

im not trying to be sarcastic, because you all are smart and know what that is, and since you all are trying to help me, im sure you will explain to me what cycling is.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Thu, 28 Feb 2008 05:36:26 GMT

"Peaceful" is a relative term. They are peaceful for damsels.

RE: damsles?

ILovePuffers — Wed, 27 Feb 2008 22:32:01 GMT

My yellow tail damsels are pretty territorial. The will dart at the clownfish and attack my algae magnet endlessly when in move it over twoards their live rock.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 06:14:05 GMT

Yellow tailed and azure damsels are quite peaceful, as are blue-green chromis if kept in a proper school (like clowns, chromis are damsels as well). I would avoid any of the black and white ones which include the three lined damsel...I have read that they are all pretty aggressive and what I have seen of them in pet stores supports that. Also avoid damsels of the Pomacentrus genus (blue devils and the like), which are known to be very nasty.

RE: damsles?

HuntValley — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 04:10:16 GMT

Other then clowns, are there any other "peaceful" (i guess less aggressive would be more appropriate) damsels out there to add to a "community" tank? I've read the three lined damsels are ok if they are added last. But, just being a newbie, i;ve found just because i've read it some where, doesnt make it so.

RE: damsles?

oceana7 — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:33:23 GMT

I agree with Hailey. I used Damsels and found them to be little bullies.

RE: damsles?

tmac1rebok — Wed, 16 Jan 2008 11:06:26 GMT

what size the tank? If its small you can eventually get damsels because there colorful fish that do much better in smaller tanks. With a larger tank, you have more possibilities with the most colorful fish around.

RE: damsles?

xOXiDiZEx — Sun, 13 Jan 2008 13:52:24 GMT

Yeah i fishless cycled my tank and then once its cycled i put a clean up crew to help with algae.. Then i added to the clean up crew and bought a pair of ocellaris Clownfish wich are doing great. If you go this route then try and find some clowns that are born in a tank rather than wild caught. also as far as i know Ocellaris clownfish are the least agresive of the clownfish so there good with most other fish...

RE: damsles?

plecodiscus — Sat, 12 Jan 2008 05:55:53 GMT

Be really careful about adding damsels, since they're so aggressive. If I were you, i'd start out with clowns. that's cause they're so peaceful and easy to care for.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:49:41 GMT

I'm thinking of cases like when you are rescuing a fish for a friend or something...I have seen that come up here. If it's either the toilet for the fish or an uncycled tank, the tank is the right choice. That's one that popped into my head, but I know I have seen other situations like that. They're not ideal, but they happen.

RE: damsles?

ILuvMyGoldBarb — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:19:07 GMT

To be honest with you Hailey, I can't really think of a situation where cycling with fish is necessary. If you can get access to an ammonia source or pre-cycled filter material then cycling would not require fish at all.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 07:17:55 GMT

Well said. There are situations that require cycling with fish, but they are rare, and when it is not required, why put a living creature through the pain and possible death that cycling with fish can bring? It's also a lot harder since it requires daily water testing and possibly daily water changes too. I don't know about you, but I would much rather test the water every couple of days and only have to do one water change in that month, than to do it every day. Most proponents of cycling with fish today seem to just not have an understanding of fishless cycling...I run into this with my lfs a lot. They're appalled that I use ammonia to cycle my freshwater tanks, but they don't understand the process.

RE: damsles?

ILuvMyGoldBarb — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 04:32:15 GMT

Responsible fish keeping is something that needs to be promoted more and cycling a tank in this day with fish is just not responsible. It can be done without them and it should be done without them since the cycle subjects them to such harsh environments that does in the long run shorten their life span.

BTW. please turn off your Capslock, posting in all caps is equivalent to yelling online.

RE: damsles?

ilikeeels — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 03:02:55 GMT

I THINK DAMSELS ARE SOME OF THE BEST FISH FOR A SALTWATER SETUP. THEY ARE COLORFUL,LIVELY, AND ENGAGING. USING THEM TO CYCLE YOUR TANK IS A GOOD WAY TO GET THE BENEFICIAL BACTERIA NEEDED FOR YOUR FILTRATION SYSTEM.

EVERY TANK I HAVE INCLUDES DAMSELS. I HAVE NEON OR VELVET DAMSELS,BLUE DAMSELS,YELLOWTAIL DAMSELS,THREE STRIPE AND DOMINO DAMSELS. I ALSO HAVE SEVERAL SERGEANT MAJOR FISH WHICH I THINK ARE IN THE SAME FAMILY AS DAMSELS AND HAVE PROVEN EQUALLY HARDY.

PLEASE CONSIDER CAREFULLY WHICH DAMSELS YOU WOULD LIKE TO HAVE AS PERMANENT MEMBERS OF YOUR SETUP AND THEN USE THEM TO CYCLE. I WISH YOU GOOD LUCK WITH SALTWATER FISHKEEPING.

RE: damsles?

Hailey — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 18:58:23 GMT

Amen to that! Fishless cycling is the way to go. With live rock in the tank it goes really quickly too. Much safer for the fish, and you don't get stuck with super aggressive fish that you can't stock anything after.

RE: damsles?

ILuvMyGoldBarb — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 17:21:02 GMT

I think that you need to cycle the tank without fish. Dead shrimp at your local grocery store are even cheaper than Damsels. Toss one of those in the tank and 4-6 weeks later you have a cycled tank.

damsles?

MoorishIdol — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 17:07:42 GMT

my friend told me that i should start my salt water tank with damsels, because they are cheap and hardy. what do you think