Zebra Danio tail fins - chomped or fin rot?

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Zebra Danio tail fins - chomped or fin rot? Expand / Collapse
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Posted 2/1/2008 2:52:29 PM


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29 gal tank, 6 Danios (3 zebra, 3 golden), 1 Dalmation Molly. My ph is naturally high, about 8.4; ironically the hardness is "very soft." Had the tank about a month--still cycling.

A couple days ago noticed one of the zebra Danios' tail fins were noticibly shorter, a bit ragged on ends. She was hanging near the bottom mostly, tail drooped down, breathing fast. No other symptoms on her body. But she rushed up to eat and still does. She seems to be avoiding the other fish; when they come near she darts away but always comes back to the same spot (just a large patch of gravel in the center away from decorations).

Tested the water and Nitrites and ammonia was high, did partial water change and added Ammo Lock.

In closely observing the tank, noticed teeny little living things living in the gravel. Appeared to be two eyes and a long thin body, a little longer than this exclamation point! I wondered if she had laid eggs and they hatched (how long does that take?) and if that would explain her exhaustion and shorter tail?

Or was it just stress from the high nitrites/ammonia? And if so, what are the things?

Finncatt

Post #138707
Posted 2/1/2008 3:14:00 PM


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Would be good to know what the rest of the parameters are.  What are you readings for Ammonia and Nitrite? 

Sounds like some sort of poisoning (hard breathing) and fin rot or bacterial infection.  Ragged edges are usually a sign. 

Are you using dechlorinater?  Any other water conditioners?

~M

Every year of my life I grow more convinced that it is wisest and best to fix our attention on the beautiful and the good, and dwell as little as possible on the evil and the false."

~ Richard Cecil

Post #138714
Posted 2/1/2008 4:37:44 PM


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From the sound of it shes guarding babies and sick....unless they are a parasite of some sort..

"We are Starfleet officers, Weird is a part of the job" - Captain Janeway, USS Voyager


Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. Do not put your faith in what statistics say until you have carefully considered what they do not say.
Post #138736
Posted 2/1/2008 4:43:13 PM


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Wow. Went to check my logbook for test results and decided to do another series of tests since I didn't do it yesterday and I did a partial H2o change two days ago.

Ammonia was 4.0 (liquid "8 drops, two bottle" test), Nitrites in the "stress" range, Nitrates in the "Danger" range on test strips. I can't believe it jumped that high in two days.

Immediately did 25% water change. (yes, I use a dechlorinator, Aquasafe).

Tested after and Ammonia was 1.0, still not good, but better.

Checked my logbook and this 29 gallon tank was started 13 January, so it is only a couple weeks old. Does it get any easier?

Finncatt

Post #138739
Posted 2/1/2008 4:46:21 PM


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Sorry - mistake -- Nitrates were in stress range and Nitrites in Danger range.

Finncatt
Post #138741
Posted 2/1/2008 4:50:36 PM


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You mentioned that this tank was started mid January. I have to ask, is your tank cycled?

__________________________________________ 
 
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Post #138742
Posted 2/1/2008 8:29:22 PM


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Ph at 8.4 and ammonia at 4.0.... Very very bad. I am surprised any fish are still living in your tank. Please say three hail Hailey's and report to the fishless cycling threads....

Ammonia becomes extremely toxic when the Ph is high. Any level over .25 will cause permanent problems for your fish. Nitrites need to be kept below 1.0 as well. Amquell plus after a water change would be helpfull as it works on both ammonia and nitrites. As a final note keep an eye on the Ph for a while too. With your soft water the Ph may change very fast causing even more problems.....

It takes about 6 weeks on average to fully cycle a tank.


"We are Starfleet officers, Weird is a part of the job" - Captain Janeway, USS Voyager


Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. Do not put your faith in what statistics say until you have carefully considered what they do not say.
Post #138788
Posted 2/2/2008 6:34:30 AM


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Tank is not cycled yet, only had it a little over two weeks. Lumberjack, thanks for the advice on Amquel. Never heard of it, I'll get it today.

If I have any advice for newbies, it is to read/study everything and then get to know your water--the water you intend to use in tanks--before you purchase ANYTHING.

Had I done all that, I would have bought a 75 gal long tank (instead of a 10 gal I gave up on then a 29gal tall because I didn't know better), I would have not bought fish until the tank was cycled, and then went with cichlids or something that prefers high PH water, since mine is 8.4 to 8.6 out of the tap. Problem is, it's very very soft too--tests at the far left on a strip. I tried PH decreasers but because of the softness, it fights back to high PH in a day or two. I started adding store bought spring water with lower PH with every water change, but heating it is a pain (microwaving water, pouring it into baggies within baggies, floating it in bucket of tank-to-be water--repeat about 8 times until it's the right temp. Takes about and hour and a half!). And after all that, because it's only 25-30% change, it fights back to high PH in about 3 days. So I gave up and use tap water.

Finncatt

Post #138805
Posted 2/2/2008 6:56:04 AM
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Just keep up on testing and water changes and don't worry about the pH for now...the ammonia and nitrite are what matter at the moment. With a pH that high you really need to keep both ammonia and nitrite at or below .5ppm (.25ppm or lower is better if you can). That may mean doing 4-5 water changes a day at first and at least once a day after because you're cycling with quite a lot of fish (the first month or so you should only have two or three fish in that size tank).

I am concerned that the damage has probably already been done though. The fish that are in the tank now may never be truly healthy, and will need to be handled very carefully (i.e. fully quarantining all new additions to the tank to avoid introducing disease, avoiding cross-contamination with other tanks, frequent small water changes to avoid shock and keep the water in tip-top condition, etc). If you treat them well they may live a fairly long life, but if not, they will probably get every disease in the book as you add new fish without quarantining or get a little behind on water changes, so be careful.

As for the sick danio, yes it sounds like fin rot, but more as a symptom of ammonia and nitrite poisoning than a disease per se. With that in mind I wouldn't attempt to treat it...just get the water right and if she's going to make it, she will probably recover on her own. I don't know about the little things in the gravel...could be fry if they are swimmming (sometimes fish breed in really stressful conditions in a attempt to pass on their genetic material before they die), but if they are wormlike and stuck to things, they could be planaria. which would be a sign of overfeeding (which I suspect anyway given the fast rising ammonia). I would cut back on food dramatically, even feeding only once every few days, just as much as they can eat and no more. That will help with the ammonia issue too.

Good luck.


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Post #138807
Posted 2/2/2008 12:19:09 PM


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For right now Finncat just concentrate on getting the cycling done. Dont bother about the Ph untill you have a good idea of how it behaves and know for sure what you want to do with it if anything.

"We are Starfleet officers, Weird is a part of the job" - Captain Janeway, USS Voyager


Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. Do not put your faith in what statistics say until you have carefully considered what they do not say.
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